| Author | Message | ||
     Terri Edmonston Username: Terri1 Registered: 01-2007 |
Hello Everyone, I have seen these little lead flowers and ornaments, which seem to be soldered on top of the lead came, in fanlights in Dublin. (I'm American, I just moved here a few months ago). I was wondering if anyone knew what they were called, and where to buy them? Or even how to make them? Thank you Terri | ||
| Tony Banfield Username: Tony Registered: 12-2006 |
I've never seen them on window-cames, but lead-flashing on Victorian and Edwardian buildings used sometimes to have moulded flowers to disguise the seams.....our 1907 villa in Oldham (oxymoron there!)had such flowers on the sheets of lead which were on the perpendicular walls below the upstairs bay windows. They seemed to be moulded. I would imagine what you have seen were moulded, although they might have been hand-made from snipped and manipulated sheet-lead. | ||
| Tony Banfield Username: Tony Registered: 12-2006 |
"I was wondering if anyone knew what they were called, and where to buy them? " Intrigued about where to get such lead flowers, I found these guys on the internet.... Registered Office Midland Lead Manufacturers Limited Kiln Way Woodville SWADLINCOTE Derbyshire DE11 8ED Tel : +44 [0] 1283 224 555 Fax : +44 [0] 1283 550 284 http://www.midlandlead.co.uk/applications.asp?application=17 Vwalla!!!!! | ||
| Vic Rothman Username: Vic2 Registered: 12-2006 |
They are generally called "rosettes". They are cast in lead. Very popular in the US in "Federal" style homes. | ||
| Pat from Canvey Username: Pat Registered: 12-2006 |
Or you could melt down your lead scraps and pour into a mould of your choice. See http://www.tiranti.co.uk/ for mould making materials. | ||
| Rona Moody Username: Rona Registered: 12-2006 |
I'd have serious health and safety concerns about melting down lead... check it out really carefully! | ||
| Terri Edmonston Username: Terri1 Registered: 01-2007 |
Hi The midland lead manufacturers does look like what I was looking for. And the mould making too. Thanks for all the info. Wish me luck. | ||
| Rebecca Hartman-Baker Username: Rebecca2 Registered: 09-2007 |
Hi! I knew I read a thread on rosettes somewhere. I finally found it. I went last night to look at some sidelights with rosettes on the lead joints. Some of them are missing and the owner asked if I could duplicate them. The house was built in 1916; one of the town's founding father's built it. AND - it is right across the road from MY house. I am hoping to get pictures Sunday. Then I will probably be back with questions. Rebecca | ||
| Rebecca Hartman-Baker Username: Rebecca2 Registered: 09-2007 |
I have pictures. If anyone is interested let me know and I will put them on Picture Trail. I also have a lot of questions: Can I make a mold without plucking one off of the windows? If not, how can I take one off without further damaging the came? If I get new ones made to replace the missing ones, how do I put them onto the came? Rebecca | ||
| Ed the Editor Username: Ed_the_editor Registered: 11-2006 |
Rebecca, You can post one of your pictures here if you like. Read how by clicking on Help/Instructions at the bottom of this screen. | ||
| Tony Banfield Username: Tony Registered: 12-2006 |
"Can I make a mold without plucking one off of the windows?" 1)Cover an original with a big blob of "playdough" or cold-cure rubber (from modelling stores) or a similar mouldable material (having coated the rosette in olive oil or something as a release-agent.) 2)Make knife-slices in the dough to be able to pull it off the rosette...push it back into shape with the "hole" wgere the rosette was. 3) Fill the playdough-mould with Plaster of Paris to give you a positive plaster rosette of the lead original. 4) Coat that positive with a release-agent and make a HOLLOW negative-mould from which to cast... Google "lead-casting" for instructions like these.. http://www.duckworksmagazine.com/06/columns/rob/index4.htm ________________________________________________ "If I get new ones made to replace the missing ones, how do I put them onto the came?" I would imagine that you could do a quick blow-torch joint with flux paste and solder, what plumbers call "sweating" to make the joint. http://members.shaw.ca/sask.rail/model-book/soldering/soldering.html Get a plumber's advice on how to do it if you think you might overheat and crack the glass. | ||
| Rebecca Hartman-Baker Username: Rebecca2 Registered: 09-2007 |
I'll try.  | ||
| Tony Banfield Username: Tony Registered: 12-2006 |
Nice pic, Beccuh! I'd try and mould the central rose and the outer trifoliate bits as separate elements. Make sure that the owner knows this will be a fiddly and possibly expensive process for even such small architecural elements. Have you given him a price? | ||
| Rebecca Hartman-Baker Username: Rebecca2 Registered: 09-2007 |
No price - I didn't even claim I could do it. I just told her I would see if I can find out how to do it. I'm thinking that getting the pieces stuck onto the existing came will be the hard part. And I don't know how many are missing. Rebecca | ||
| Tony Banfield Username: Tony Registered: 12-2006 |
PS Is that picture on its side? ....and I presume that's you reflected in the panes of glass! | ||
| Rebecca Hartman-Baker Username: Rebecca2 Registered: 09-2007 |
I was on the ground on my side when I took it. Yeah, the picture is on its side. I didn't even notice me in the picture, but my son started laughing the minute he saw it. | ||
| Rebecca Hartman-Baker Username: Rebecca2 Registered: 09-2007 |
I did a little experimenting today in the shop. I found a lead figure with a detailed head. It is a female with flowers and ribbons in her hair. I pushed the back of her head into modeling clay, then peeled the clay off. Then I poured plaster of Paris into the cavity. When I went back and peeled the clay off of the plaster, I was surprised that the plaster had all of the detail of the original. Vic sent me to www.miniaturemolds.com for mold-making tools and materials. Tomorrow I am going to try to remember to go by on the way to the shop and press some clay onto the rosettes. I hope it works! Rebecca | ||
| Tony Banfield Username: Tony Registered: 12-2006 |
Well, surprise surprise, casting (done for thousands of years from Assyria to Egypt, Greece to India to China) DOES work! A little casting tip I remember being posted aeons ago by Vancouver Island LeadMeister (soi-disant) Dennis Brady (Blessed Be His Name, Peace Be Upon Him.) Apparently he does/did/got-his-crew-to-do quite a bit of lead-casting of lead gewgaws (dragonfly and insect bodies etc etc). He said that for short runs of castings (which yours would be), it's worth the while to set the mould in a 2-3foot long "sling" of wire or material, and after the molten lead is poured into the mould but while it's still molten , to whirl the mould slowly round your head (making sure no-one is in range of a booboo) for a minute or so, so that centrifugal-force pushes the fast-setting lead into all the details of the mould. I was always impressed by what seemed to be a good and sensible low-tech "injection-moulding"-type solution to getting a sharp casting. | ||
| Rebecca Hartman-Baker Username: Rebecca2 Registered: 09-2007 |
Ummm - I think that will be my son's job. Rebecca | ||
| Rebecca Hartman-Baker Username: Rebecca2 Registered: 09-2007 |
I actually cast some rosettes today! They aren't perfect, but now I think I will be able to help my neighbor. I will post some pictures if I can get some. | ||
| Rebecca Hartman-Baker Username: Rebecca2 Registered: 09-2007 |
I finally got a camera, but the rosettes are all installed. I took another picture of myself reflected in the window, with rosettes:  | ||
| Tony Banfield Username: Tony Registered: 12-2006 |
Well done, Beckuh! I take it the casting worked...tell all,dearheart... .... how did you attach the new rosettes? | ||
| Rebecca Hartman-Baker Username: Rebecca2 Registered: 09-2007 |
Attached the new ones clinging to a 12-foot step ladder. Scraped the old lead and solder with a knife until it was shiny. Used Vic's stick flux and 63/37 solder to tin the spot where the rosette would go. Tinned the rosette, too. Then stuck them together and held the rosette with one hand while poking them with a soldering iron. When it was stuck, I put a little patina on it and brushed it with whiting. Also cleaned the glass with whiting. | ||
| Rebecca Hartman-Baker Username: Rebecca2 Registered: 09-2007 |
Here is the pot I used to melt the lead.  | ||
| Rebecca Hartman-Baker Username: Rebecca2 Registered: 09-2007 |
Here are molds made out of QuickSil from the website I posted before.  | ||
| Rebecca Hartman-Baker Username: Rebecca2 Registered: 09-2007 |
And here are leftover rosettes. The dark one in the front right corner has patina on it.  | ||
| Tony Banfield Username: Tony Registered: 12-2006 |
Excellento castings and pix ---- congratulations on both! You heard it here on October 1! | ||
| Rebecca Hartman-Baker Username: Rebecca2 Registered: 09-2007 |
Thank you, Tony! Rebecca |